If you enjoy what you read here you will also enjoy my novel
21 days in May
Please be aware this blog may be considered Illegal almost anywhere!
Showing posts with label koran. Show all posts
Showing posts with label koran. Show all posts

To Indoctrinate or Not

To those poor families forced to now feel shame and grief because of their sons' delusions, I genuinely offer deepest sympathies and best wishes.

However, I feel compelled to raise what seems to me a fairly obvious point...
"Hello, good evening and welcome to 'Britons Today'.
I'm your host, Su Spicious and, first up is Mrs Unbe Liever, whose son is not one of the many young men who have rushed off to fight in one of the many 'holy' wars currently raging.
Mrs Liever. Welcome."

"Thank you, Su. Delighted to be here."

"Now, Mrs Liever, could you explain just how your son not going off to fight in this latest 'holy' war has made you feel?"

"Well, I said to his father, 'what shall we indoctrinate the lad with, Father?' This was not long after the boy was newborn and I'd had a few pamphlet through, so I asked, I said, 'should we go with the barbaric classics, the Torah, Bible and Qur'an or switch it up a bit and baste the bairn in Hindu? Or, maybe, go with more modern day voodoo like scientololologism or the new-wave crystalline wiccadruids.' I mean, y'know it's a tough choice! So many to choose from! 'I've read all the pamphlets', I said, 'and they're all much of a muchness!"
And he said, not straight away mind; he carried on staring into the fire in silence for a bit, like he did, then he said something that I really wasn't expecting.
'You now what, mother?' He said, he had a very deep voice, that's one of the things that first attracted me, 'You know what? I don't think any of them make any sense!'
Well, it raised my eyebrow, I can tell you, but before I could say anything he continued, which in itself was unusual, not a very verbose chap y'know, anyway, he said. 'I've had deer poop' only he didn't say poop, he was a bit of a lad; luv 'im. 'I've had deer poop in my socks for a month now; just exactly as Morgana at the 'wishes & wants emporium' said to do, and Nothing! No improvement whatever! I tell ya, I don't think any of those people, who wax all lyrical about magical things, actually know anything about magical things! And, if they don't know anything about 'em, maybe there are no magic things!"
I was dumbstruck! I just sat and watched as he angrily tore off his poopy socks, then tentatively offered, 'You are suggesting we don't indoctrinate him at all, Father?'
'I am, Mother.' He said, he was deadly serious and when he's deadly serious it's always worth thinking about. So I did, I thought about it a bit, and what I thought was Kylie, my tarot card reader, never gets anything right! And it made me feel he might just be onto something. So after a moment or two I agreed, I said to him.
'Right, that's settled, then. I can stop worrying about it and recycle all those inane pamphlets!' As I stood to collect them, a thought struck me... 'So that the lad has the best chance of learning to think for himself, maybe we should abstain from practising our indoctrinations while he grows into an adult?" Well, father looked at me with such a loving smile on his face; proud, y'know.
'That's my girl,' he said, 'always thinking two steps ahead.'
So we didn't indoctrinate him in anything. And now, with all these kids leaving to join in some 'holy' war or other, I'm thrilled with our choice.
So many of those who chose to indoctrinate their precious sons have lost them to the violence of ideological war that their child only learned about from the book of their indoctrination! It's very sad, they must feel like they've betrayed their own children. And now, sadly, each and every one of them will never know the joy of being grandparents. Whereas, my son and his partner are expecting my third grandchild.

I just wish Father were still alive to see the wonderful fruits of our choice."

And so to the questions...

Is it possible for one who is NEVER branded and indoctrinated with an ideology to consider Jihad, Crusade or other "holy" war justified and worthwhile?
If one has never been taught to believe 'there is a paradise waiting for you', can one be persuaded to offer one's life for any cause promising paradise for those killed in pursuit of it?
On both counts, I think not.

However, this is not how the great multitudes of indoctrinated have been, and are being, educated to think...



At about 50 seconds into the report the obviously troubled father asks...
"Who made fatwa for them to go there? On what basis?"
I feel that one may only conclude that the unspoken subtext of that mental position is...
"If one of my righteous religious leaders had got it in his head to call a fatwa, then it would be fine. I wouldn't be annoyed, shocked or worried.
I'd be rejoicing in my son's honourable participation in glorious holy Jihad.
"

So as a final ponder...
Can we honestly continue to pretend that these "warrior for god" concepts are not promoted in books, which almost all of society hail as "instructions direct from god"?
Is it not time for us all stop pretending these books are benign?
Might it be time to eradicate them, or at the very least edit them?

More on this theme...
To Offer Or Not Offer Belief, Scripture Scramble Religious Gameshow or Presentation for 3rd Annual International Day of Protest against Hereditary Religion

This is one of the Too Many Questions
PEACE
Crispy
Please leave a comment - Anything will do
The best communications are often,
THREE WORDS OR LESS
OR ONE OR MORE FINGERS!

A Review of The Qur'ans Unique Literary Form by Hamza Andreas Tzortzis

The article this post is critiquing is here

Firstly, to be picky; hey this is all about meaning of language so, about the title.
It's a puzzle; "The Qur'ans" is plural. To show the possession by "The Qur'an" of a "Unique literary form", should it not be "Qur'an's"? I feel if the plural is meant the "The Qur'ans" seems clumsy and has something of an incompatibility with the later part of the title; for "Qur'ans" should it not end in "literary Forms"? Also, if Hamza did mean the plural i.e. all the individual copies, then "unique" still, I presume, applies to only the content of the text. It would be unsupportable to claim that each individual copy, of a book which numbers in the billions, were unique as, surely, the point of a doctrine is that they all say EXACTLY the same?

So... Title: Grammatically suspect, misleading; legerdemain or merely poor proof-reading?

In Section 1. - Paragraph 1. "Read in the name of your lord"
This suggests one should substitute (read in) your personal god's name wherever you see "Allah"; for it to be an instruction or plea, "In the name of your lord, please read this", there would need to be a comma after read (Read, in the name of you lord)
This paragraph also shows this work is biased from the outset. Here alone there are three indications that the author has already bought Muhammad's story as fact; he describes the text as revealed(X1), received (X2). Surely an academic evaluation of the discovered evidence should be suspended until the conclusion of such a work.
There's a Karen Armstrong quote: "...Without this experience of the Koran, it is extremely unlikely that Islam would have taken root", fair enough that may have been a factor but I suggest it was probably a bigger factor that Muhammad strapped the Jewish god's 'believe or burn' eternal torture clause to the underbelly of each page.

Paragraph 3.
"it became the only reference for a new state..."

To a collection of barbaric and conflicted tribes with disparate gods and beliefs any new law form to which all can subscribe is better than what was. It doesn't make it miraculous, just better.

Paragraph starts: "According Qur'anic Exegetes"
The opinion that "it has not been matched"
Is there a properly funded and encouraged competition to fulfil the Qur'an challenge and 'out Muhammad the Koran'? Is it held annually? Across the whole Muslim world? How many attempts have been made to write even one verse better? Are there any books with titles like "5 ways to write better Qur'an"? "?
To call it inimitable one must wait until the end of the universe, for tomorrow, "if Allah wills it", as the author and his groupies would no doubt sycophantically say, someone may surpass it, even in the eyes of its devotees. .
One may only legitimately state that, thus far, this literary style, which it’s suggested Muhammad invented, has not been matched (because it's Haraam?).
And, if there’s not a competition, is it because of the two quotes later in Section 7?
"These are the limits set by God, so do not approach them"
"These are the limits set by God, so do not transgress them"

All readers of the Qur’an are prohibited by Muhammad from trying to better his work? How very reminiscent of a fascist dictator! Also, is it not intellectually dishonest, of any scholar, to hail as "unmatched, in all this time!" a work which itself commands it is Haraam (sacrilage) even to try? I mean isn't that just stating the obvious; whom among those sufficiently enthralled to produce a passable facsimile would risk immortal torment? ("Your Point Is Not Valid" expands on this.)

Section 2. - Paragraph 2(end)
"It has been one of its kind and nothing like it has ever preceded it or followed it."

This statement is highly presumptive. One cannot prove that the great libraries of antiquity did not have many examples of ‘Muhammad’s style’, so we cannot say any more than it is unique amongst the surviving literature. Also, there are, and have been, numerous aural history recitation cultures around the globe, I'd suggest that the sing-song style of recitation would be aide memoire to any culture which employs the practice. The Koran may simply be the only transcribed or only surviving transcribed work in the style of a lyrical 'aural history'.

In the sub-section "What is Arabic poetry"
“In summation the definition of Arabic poetry is that it has...
End Rhyme ...
Syllabic Rhythmical Pattern.”

Is this not specious? Surely, these definitions of Arabic poetry evolved naturally, they were not rules laid out before the poets started writing. Arabic poetry rules, as with all poetry rules, are the result of collating and evaluation all the forms of poetry that poets conceived to be aesthetic to their culture then viewing them all with a chronological hindsight to assess where they fit within the poetry fossil record, so to speak. Couldn't it be said that Muhammad's manifesto simply spans a number of poetry strata?

In the sub-section "What is Arabic Prose?"
"In summary the definition of Saj’ is that it has a...
Accentual rhythmical pattern
End rhyme
Concentrated use of rhetorical features"

"In summary the definition of Mursal is that it has...
No rhythmical pattern
No rhyme
A resemblance to straight forward speech"


Whilst the point made for poetry applies also to the evolution of prose, prose seems to have the added disadvantage of being
"rhythmic OR not rhythmic"
"With an end rhyme OR without"
"Rhetorically featured OR not"
One may conclude from this pamphlet that Arabic prose has 'whatever works' as its rule.

Section 3.
“...the style of the Koran is modelled upon saj"

Can a work which is modelled upon another style legitimately be called unique? I'd term it derivative.
Also in this section, Hamza freely quotes that scholars see evidence of saj in the early verses but not the latter. For me, this simply shows that Muhammad's initial instinct was to create it all in Saj but as his work progressed either, he got tired of the restriction of Saj, found it too difficult to portray his meaning through the Saj style, or got more confident with his own written voice. Where a teacher may simply put a line through verses that did not comply with the standard style, and mark it "Try Harder" are scholars, perhaps guilty of being overly reverent or fearful, excusing Muhammad's inability to finish in the same style with which he started, by calling it a new style?

"iii. Qur’an bound stylistic variations"
"Furthermore the Qur’an uses literary and linguistic devices in such a way that has not been used before and achieves an unparalleled communicative effect"

"Literary & linguistic devices not used before." - Hmmm, watch a number of comedians; every joke is based on the transposition of literary and linguistic devices, the more you laugh the more these techniques have surprised you. If you'd heard them before you'd not have laughed (as much).

Section 4 to 6 (inclusive)
These sections deal with the literary components of Muhammad’s manifesto and display why the Qur’an is different, and how so, from the main literary styles. They expand on the ‘Not poem’ & ‘Not prose’ theme, which I find an unremarkable distinction to make (seems like 1400 years worth of naval gazing to me) as in my experience a writer uses, as and when he needs it, the form which most suits his purpose. I’m simply not qualified to judge comparative Arabic literature, so I’ve no comments for these sections other than, they offer no evidence that human’s have souls so are of interest only to those who study literary forms.

Section 7.
"Essential devices employed to enhance the communicative, psycholinguistic and rhetorical effect"

I realise this is only an example but this, and the rest of this section, sounds to me a lot like a very good description of the manipulative and divisive techniques employed by those who practice on the dark side of neuro-linguistic programming.

Section 8. Conclusion
"There are many Muslim and Non-Muslim Scholars who testify that the Qur’an is indeed unique and inimitable."


The contents of the Qur'an are considered "special", Muhammad’s collection of ideas & concepts, some of which I concede for their time, were brilliant, but the brand of uniqueness they carry is only in that they are the work of a single human. Similar schemes, proposals, manifestos or formats for human existence can be found far and wide in the transcribed thoughts of a multitude of accredited or self-styled ‘thinkers’; Marx, Plato, Hitler, Buddha or any number of authors of self help books.
(I realise that "single human" is a disputable point but unless, or until, it can be proved that human's have 'immortal souls', there is no eternity with which to concern oneself so, we are only talking about the thoughts of a single human.)
To be fair does anyone else write lyrics that read like Eminem wrote them or deliver them quite like Eminem? There are millions of Elvis impersonators around the world but none are really 'Elvisian' and even fewer could be said to be a perfect facsimile or 'like Elvis reborn'. Has there ever been an equal to Bach whom one could mistake for him?
The greater and more unique the human talent the less chance there is of that talent being imitable.

While this pamphlet is obviously well researched it can only be held as a literary review of a text. There are no points within the pamphlet which prove a man could NOT have concocted the Qur'an and in fact, that it attempts but fails to be a derivative of Saj, suggests to me exactly the opposite, that it could NOT have been concocted by a god.

That attempts at repeating the feat are prohibited by the text does it no favours. If it were of an omniscient god, that god would know that it is inimitable and not need to make the despotic instruction prohibiting any attempt.
I feel as a progressive human, if one is told a thing cannot be improved upon, it’s an imperative to strive to do that very thing. Without attempts to do so, it is merely an unsubstantiated statement.

Hamza uses the word unique, that it may be, or any number of other descriptive words, "remarkable", "dumbfounding" etc. However, that it may be inimitable, means only that it may be inimitable. As a being who has no soul on which these mumbo-jumbo notions of magic can have effect, the best I can say is "I concede experts in it's field concur it's a literary masterpiece" but as to the "actual words of a god"?

Sorry Hamza, me ol' kidder, nothing in your pamphlet proves that outlandish claim.


More from the intellectually dishonest Islamists, the international man of mythtery & his groupies.
This is one of the Too Many Questions
PEACE
Crispy
Please leave a comment - Anything will do
The best communications are often,
THREE WORDS OR LESS
OR ONE OR MORE FINGERS!

Stupid Is As Stupid Does

From an interview on Channel 4 News after the brutal and savage attack by Muslims on the UN in Afghanistan..
"Ahmad Gul, teacher and resident of Mazar-i-Sharif said:
'We had a peaceful protest. We went to the UNAMA (United Nation Assistance Mission for Afghanistan) compound and tried to disarmed their guards by taking their guns away, so there will be no violence.
'But they still fired on us and wounded our people, two were killed and 14 were wounded.'"

Channel 4

This sounds a lot like a bullshit excuse to conceal the blood lust of a mob but if we are to take it at face value; that it's actually a truthful relaying of events and not just an excuse then sheesh, how the hell do you measure stupidity on this scale?
"...tried to disarmed their guards by taking their guns away, so there will be no violence."
My dear sweet stupid Muslim's,

Attempting to take a guard's weapon is a violent act, it's likely to be one of the fastest ways to start violence! The guards would have been fearing for their lives! I mean, to be fair, if any non-Muslim was 'approached' by thousands of angry Muhammadan's the last thing he/she is going to expect is for the mob to be reserved and polite! I know I'd not be expecting a peaceful chat over cucumber sandwiches but rather, the primitive savage violence we've come, sadly, to know and abhor.
Further though, the guards have a duty to protect those in their charge. Nobody who was in their right mind (Yes, that implies that I don't consider to be in your right minds) would expect a guard to hand over his weapon! If all guard's were to just hand over their means of protecting those in their charge at the first sight of 2000 angry protesters, they wouldn't be called guards they'd be called surrender monkeys.
There are rules you know, the proper way of doing things; you know that, right?1
Oh no, wait, maybe you don't! Is there a rule in the Koran about not being so stupid that you try taking a guard's weapon away? Probably not, eh? But every other human on the planet (about 80% of the global population) would know it. I guess the Qur'an doesn't have all the answers, best get a book on etiquette. (There's a suitable book suggestion below)
Peace, Crispy
1Before you go getting all bent out of shape that I'm not handing out equal admonishment to all the naughty boys, here's my view on that dickhead Jones. Link

Perhaps they don't know about the ways of the rest of the world because they are not proprly educated in them? I mean, most Muslims, I assume, would at least be 'peer pressure proud' to admit they only want/know Sharia law. Indeed all secular law is considered by the majority(?) to be inferior to the Shariat. I'd also suggest that the same statement can be made for there opinion of the Qur'an.
As I see it, when one is taught to believe something is inferior, it's easy to ignore it, to disregard it, be disrespectful of it, and feel justified in doing so because you also been taught to believe you are following the ONLY right and proper 'superior' law.

While orthodox Islam continues to promote this vile supremacist attitude, how can any free thinking human not view it as 'too similar to Nazism for comfort'?

This is one of the Too Many Questions
PEACE
Crispy
Please leave a comment - Anything will do
The best communications are often,
THREE WORDS OR LESS
OR ONE OR MORE FINGERS!

Holy Book Burning Batman

On 20th March 2011 Pastor Terry Jones burned a Qur'an and, apart from the fact that I'm Welsh, I'm totally in agreement with this commentators view of it
In spite of all the absurdity and chicanery of this “mock trial” and the sophomoric behavior of its master-mind, I find this whole affair to be not at all amusing. To the contrary, it is not only a shameful display of religious bigotry and ignorance, but also a burlesque-like mockery of our system of jurisprudence. All things considered, it is frighteningly childish act.

Article here

On 1st April 2011 Muslims in Afghanistan were told (some reports say by the taliban) that (some reports say thousands of copies of) the Koran had been burned.
Later that day thousands of Muslims stormed the UN building and murdered a number of innocent people. They weren't the ones who burned the Muslims precious book after all.

Article: BBC

Now to me, this seems like another example of childishness, this time a childish response to news of Jones' childish act.

Angered by such mindless savagery I was moved to comment on this compounding of Jones' childishness with this murderously violent tantrum, over such an insignificant event, I tweeted...
  • "Does the violent attack on the UN in Afghanistan suggest Pastor Terry Jones was right? FFS it's only a book u dickheads #Islam #Atheism" Link
  • "A Pastor burned a Koran + a few days later violent primitive savages provided evidence of the reason he burned it. #Islam #Atheism #Truth" Link
  • "He only burned a book! In 50yrs, when they hear there was a plan for ICBP's, they'll freak. ICBP? Inter Continental ballistic pigs! #Atheism" Link
  • "Violent primitive savages kill 20 people over foreigner's choice of kindling. #Islam religion of peace - if you spell peace V-I-O-L-E-N-C-E" Link
  • "If u burn my magic paper I'll scream + stab + slay until u r stiff - Afghan Muslims: the Violet Elizabeth Bott of believers #Islam #Atheism" Link
And the violence continued today.
"Afghanistan: more deaths over Koran burning: At least nine people have been killed in the southern Afghanistan city of Kandahar as violent protests continued over the burning of a Koran in Florida.

Article: Channel 4


I had a few scolding responses for the tweets and fair enough, everyone's entitled to an opinion but this one by Fizzy08
"it is a book but ffs its an holy book. Atheism is no reason to defend the wrong doings of anyone...u have respect for ur beliefs and u need to respect the others. Thats just standard humanity criteria hence no one in the world wants violence and its condoned but violation of ones religion is not permissible under any clause of the world for anyone." Link
prompted what follows...

I am not defending the Pastor because there's nothing to defend; he has merely burned some paper - not particularly environmentally friendly but not offensive in any way. The thing is, ANY 'holy' book is only considered 'holy' because people believe it is.
If a 'Holy' book is destroyed, has the message been lost? Or was it just the message's container? Lives have been lost because someone burned, not the letter but it's envelope!
It would be hypocritical for me, an atheist, to respect those who like to fantasize that there is a god - I have No Respect For Spiritual Terrorism or for doctrine addicts
How much respect for the 'Holy' sensibilities of others did the Taliban Muslims show when they totally destroyed the centuries old Buddhas? It was wicked mindless adolescent vandalism to appease their primitive book's god!
Respect is earned and the Muslims lose credibility every time they act like savages and go ape shit crazy because some idiot ran out of toilet paper or set light to a spare copy of their favourite fairy story!

As far as I'm concerned...
If you kneel to a god - how very fucking Stone Age of you - you are an insult to human progress.

I would rather see EVERY 'holy' book publicly shredded and composted than lose one human life - a statement any religious person would find very difficult to match.

If you are religious I dare you to update your status with the statement below. If you cannot post it, then you value your afterlife dream more than you value your fellow human and as such are a crime against humanity waiting to happen.
"I believe in god but I'd rather see EVERY 'Holy' book publicly burned
than any 'Holy' book cost a single human life."


If you try to post and it makes you feel uncomfortable please be aware this is because your religion has carefully condition you to feel that way.

This is one of the Too Many Questions
PEACE
Crispy
Please leave a comment - Anything will do
The best communications are often,
THREE WORDS OR LESS
OR ONE OR MORE FINGERS!

Share

If you enjoy what you read here
you will also enjoy my novel
21 days in May


Please be aware this blog may be considered Illegal almost anywhere!

Get TMQ on your Kindle

Copyright Crispy Sea

No part of this publication may be reproduced, stored in a retrieval system, or transmitted, in any form by any means, electronic, mechanical, photocopying, or otherwise, without the prior written permission of the publisher.

All blog posts copyright http://atheist.diatribes.co.uk

TMQCrispySea 2009-2014